Man were they wrong!!!!

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by TitansWillWin2, Apr 29, 2010.

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  1. TitansJonne

    TitansJonne OG triple OG

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    Yea but he certainly didn't help himself by fumbling the ball when there was nothing but daylight in front of him. I just feel bad for seatlle because they knew the gamplan coming in. So they told themselves. Contain cj, there giving the ball to cj. Don't let cj kill us. And CJ still killed them lol
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  2. Ericgolonghorns

    Ericgolonghorns Camp Fodder

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    Since people want to argue stats I think I'll crunch some numbers from his 2009 season starting with the Jags.

    Vy's
    Average completion yards per game: 190 (rounded from 187)
    Average rush yards per game: 28
    10 Tds 6 INT ~ (2:1) ratio
    Average throw attempts per game: 25
    Average yards per game: 218

    Peyton Manning
    Average completion yards per game: 281
    Average rush yards per game: -2
    32 TD 16 INT (2:1) ratio
    Average throw attempts per game: 36
    Average yards per game:279

    So with having 144% more throwing attempts Peyton Manning managed to throw 147% more yards than vince young.. almost a 1:1 ratio. I don't know what the R^2 value would be in putting in a linear fit function but I would say that 144:147 is almost one to one and thus one could project that if VY had the same throw attempts as Peyton he'd have just as many yards.

    Peyton does have a higher TD to Int ratio than VY, but then they are comparable (almost the same) and could be chalked up to the scheme ... Titans like to run it in on goal line situations whereas Colts like to have their star do the dirty work.

    Throw in VY's run yards and it evens out even more.
    #72
  3. nate42104

    nate42104 Camp Fodder

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    If you're attempting to compare VY to Peyton, that's simply funny. If you look at Peyton's (or any top tier QB) games, they never deviate too far from their mean. For example, Wonderboy averaged an astounding 190 yards per game. On prime time in Houston he had 116 yards. In prime time at home vs San Diego in a must win game, he was 8/21 for 89 yards with 2 picks. Yes, 20% of the passes that he threw that were caught were by the other team.

    If you look at Peyton's games, they are all solid and efficient. Hell, he started the season with (5) 300 yard games in a row and if you count 299 yards vs Baltimore he had 9 out of his first 10 games with more than 300 yards. The only one he had less than 300 yards was vs St. Louis when they just try to run clock to end the game.

    We are calling the 1 game Vince threw for 300+ yards as his career game in which he broke out and became a top QB. Don't get me wrong, he played an awesome game, and deserves all the credit for that win (unless you count the doctor that told Warner he couldn't play).

    And, in the NFL, that one little TD/INT discrepancy is somewhat important. In a 'breakout' year he was 1 bad game away from again having more INT's than TD's. If he'd have played against IN New England, NY Jets, or Pittsburgh, based on his performance against the best defenses, he'd have no doubt succeeded in living up to the past. But, when you play St. Louis, Seattle, Buffalo, Jacksonville, Houston, Arizona, and i think Miami and San Fran's defenses in the 2nd half of the season, it simply amazes me that a guy can't average 200+ yards. I guess when you count the actual defense we played on December 26 and got embarrassed, it's easy to see why.

    Since we are performning statistical analysis, I find this very interesting. In the NBA a single turnover can cost your team 2 points, which only represents about 2% of all the points scored in the entire game. In the NFL a touchdown vs an interception is a 14 point swing. That represents the TOTAL number of points scored the Titans averaged in the only season he played the entire year.

    So, how important are the turnovers in the NFL? Statistically speaking, it's maybe the single best indicator to directly contribute to wins and losses. I can't speak for everyone, but that doesn't make me feel comfortable with a QB that touches the ball on EVERY offensive play who has more turnovers than touchdowns throughout his career.
    #73
  4. Puck

    Puck Pro Bowler

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    what about winning percentage ?
    #74
  5. Finnebosch

    Finnebosch I am vengeance.

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    ^^This I swear that if I knew how I'd high five you.

    I think that in the Arizona game Vince Young once again showed that he had the potentail to be an elite quaterback in the nfl, but the last drive of that game was on par with at least half of the colts' drives with Peyton Dbag.

    (was ment to nate)
    #75
  6. Gunny

    Gunny Lord and Master Tip Jar Donor

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    oh yay, nate's back to rehash the same thing over and over.
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  7. nate42104

    nate42104 Camp Fodder

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    Well, Zach Greinke's record with the Royals right now is 0-3. He has a 2.27 ERA and is pitching lights out. Unfortunately, his supporting cast on the other side of the ball can't score. That reminds me somewhat of Aaron Rodgers.

    Meanwhile, Casey Janssen of the Bluejays is 3-0 with a 6.55 ERA. I don't know much about the team, but that clearly states that he has had some serious run support on the other side of the ball. The Bluejays are winning these games for EVERY OTHER reason besides Janssen's pitching, but he gets the notch in the win column.

    By your measure, Casey Janssen is the better pitcher since it's all about wins, without looking deeper into what is really going on out there on the field. That's a pretty lazy way of comparing Vince to the rest of the NFL. As it is a disservice to Greinke to say he is one of the worst pitchers in the league because he is 0-3.
    #77
  8. Ericgolonghorns

    Ericgolonghorns Camp Fodder

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    Ya you can argue that that Peyton Manning's standard deviation is very low. I'm not comparing Vince Young per se, I was just refuting that argument some are using that VY only throws 190 yards a game - that you have to take into account the amount of attempts he has.

    Yes you are right points and turnovers are what matter, and "one bad game" meaning 5 INTS then that would be one heck of a turn for any QB, throw 5 INTS on any QB except for Peyton Manning and Brett Favre and their stats look dismal.

    However, instead of looking at indirect stats when it comes to points why not look at direct stats?

    First 6 Titans games
    Avg point per game: 14.5

    Under Vince Young
    Avg point per game: 27

    186% in points under Vince Young.

    Under Peyton Manning 2009 16 regular season games
    Avg point per game: 26

    Now look, obviously Peyton Manning is a better and more consistent QB than VY, I'm not trying to compare the two with VY coming out on top or equal, what I'm ATTEMPTING to do is compare VY with what's considered an A QB and show that the difference isn't that staggering.

    Someone made an A,B,C, grading and gave VY a C.. I think he deserves a B. I'd be more than willing to do similar comparisons with lesser QBs that are still considered good like Ben Worthlessberger, Tony Romo etc.
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  9. nate42104

    nate42104 Camp Fodder

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    Dude, we beat St. Louis 47-7 and you wanna how many yards led that game in passing? Do you really want to know? Well, it was 165 yards. And it wasn't Vince Young. It was Keith Null. Keith Null.

    So yeah, I can see how there is complete validity that Vince has directly correlated to the Titans scoring all their points.
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  10. nate42104

    nate42104 Camp Fodder

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    And, I don't want to come across as if i am defending Kerry Collins, because I'm not. He is just as terrible as Vince. But it's amazing at how on the Titans their stats are insanely similar, yet pro-Vince guys say Kerry is God awful and say Vince can lead the team to a Super Bowl.

    Kerry vs the Steelers was 22/35 for 244 yds - 1 td - 1 int

    And, against the a common opponent; Texans, here's how they fared:

    Kerry 21/33 216 yards 2 td 1 int (team scored 31 pts)
    Vince 12/22 116 yards 1 td 0 int (team scored 20 pts)

    Or the fact that when Kerry played, our defense made David Garrard look like an MVP going for 323 yards and 3 td's. And when Vince came in our defense finally got their stuff together coming off a bye week; holding Garrard to 139 yards 0 td's and 2 int's. Hell, Jamarcus Russell could have led this team to victory that week.

    Besides the Arizona game, there wasn't a single game that we won BECAUSE of quarterback play. No different than in 2008 when we won 13 games despite of our QB. Not because of him.
    #80
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