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billy volek on sportsline

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by nickel, Sep 12, 2006.

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  1. Blazing Arrow The 12th man

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    Some people do not like him! That is funny because Carolina, Oakland, New York would not step near that land mind now we are the fortunate ones? If he was worth a $1 million then someone would have taken him like the teams that are swooning us over Volek. Why do 3 teams look at Volek but none of those teams pick up Collins who they really had no competition for and could have thrown him a bone at league min and probably picked him up? He has supposed to take the #2 to Young for our team but no other team that wants Volek would even pick him up. Is that seriously your argument because that reeks of BS?

    OK? So you are agreeing I am correct in my assessment of the fact that team wants Volek. Do you refute the fact that no team wanted Collins? How about the 3 preseason weeks that no other team wanted him? Teams could have picked him up for nothing now they throw a #6. That is a Joke.

    That is easy to say when pride is not involved. When you are part of a unit that has counted on you numerous time and when it comes your shot you are punched in the groin because you did not make the right "reads" per the coaches assessment who watched the play over and over and over again. At least he gave us a chance and at least he was there for 5 years to help us when we NEEDED it. Hobbling McNair (whom I adore as a fan do not get me wrong) was out most games and the albino cobra had to charm the D for the rest of the game. I personally would have rather had him in then to watch that crap last Sunday. It was the F*ing JETS!

    Are you seriously calling that goon that they put in at 9 minutes an NFL QB. That guy will be lucky to get 5 starts in his career. Walters I believe. He is a joke in the NFL and no one gets it because they do not know who he is!

    No. But it makes you question why so many of his receivers drop balls and tip them up. Look back at his career and look at the INTs he has thrown they all seem like that. It is funny that is why so many fans are divided over him. He makes the passes but about 25% of then end up like that. Why? Who knows but it always happens with Collins. After 13 years I feel it is time to stop blaming the myriad of WRs that keep saying he is crap and start pointing the finger at the QB who throws the passes.

    So your final argument is that you think that Volek knows less or equal Titans' plays then Collins? Collins, a person who has been with the organization all of 2 weeks? Versus a #2 QB who has been with the organization for 5+ years, started 10+ times in the last 3 seasons and with has practiced 3+ weeks in preseason this current year.

    If you are buying that bologna then you need to switch markets.
  2. Banshee2 Guest

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    There wasn't the same market 3 weeks ago, IMO, for QBs. The Raiders were relatively happy with their QB situation, not realizing yet that Brooks was going to fold like the cheap suit, nor that Walters was going to be hurt at all. Plus they had Tuiasasopo (sp) as the #3. So they didn't "need" Kerry.

    Kansas City looks a lot different before #10 gets TKO'd. And San Diego wants Volek as a #2, not to compete for #1. And maybe they DID contact Collins (I read they were in the bidding before he signed w/ TN, but decided on here because of the proximity to NC. Which of course means that he knew he'd get to start for one more year....)

    Regardless, I think all this hand-wringing is for naught. I loved that BV got a shot (sort of) - it was a nice story. But I'd rather have a guy that has been around, won some games, and made it to a Super Bowl be the "example/mentor" for our 58 million-dollar QB. I'm just saying. Besides that - it's only week 2. In fact, it's the eve of playing the week 2 game.
  3. Gut Starter

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    Um....

    This is not that complicated to understand. Volek was signed to the Titans and 'supposed' to be our starter. Collins was no longer needed in Raider-land because they got a mobile QB (necessity since their OL is worse than ours) in Brooks and their QB of the future in Walters. Now you may not agree with their idea of QB of the future...but that doesn't mean anything to this argument. So most teams like us are in a wait mode....either have the stop-gap vet or are going with their inexperienced QB of the future (like SD). Can you tell me what Collins asking price was over the off-season? If not, you have no idea why teams would pass on him. I suspect he didn't want to be a backup and get backup money and he probably had his eye on a few places that either needed a vet QB to potentially start or perhaps challenge for a starting job. I suspect we got him a bit cheaper than he would have liked but was probably willing to take less because we have a good situation here for him and clearly the coaching staff was gonna give him a shot at starting.

    Collins resume is strong and solid. He has led 2 teams to the NFC title game and led 1 team to the Super Bowl. What has Volek done? Thrown a ton of yards against the worst defenses in the league for a few games? That's not much compared to leading a team to the SB. Still, Volek deserved a chance to start since they didn't sign Collins from day 1. He got 3 pre-season starts and apparently they didn't like what they saw of him running Chow's offense.

    We can agree that a few teams are willing to give up a garbage draft pick (a 6th) for Volek. This does not support the concept that he is well thought of as a good QB since the Falcons were getting MUCH better offers for Schaub and there is a real need for starters and good backups at the moment.

    'Punched in the groin for not making the right reads?' I think the idea you're looking for is...'not getting the job done.' This is a game but also a business. Volek is paid very well and got a chance to be the starting QB for this team for this year...fulfilling his dream and to showcase what he can do. Not making the right reads is a huge part of being a good QB. If he can't do it well enough, then he shouldn't be in there. You can hardly say he was punched in the groin for not playing well. You SHOULD be saying the exact opposite. There is too LITTLE accountability on this team right now. When a player stinks up the joint, he shouldn't get a pat on the back, he should get benched if the bad plays continues. And that goes for QB and every other position on offense or defense. The problem I have is there is too much of this complacent thinking. How come LT isn't benched...or Hill? At least with QB they are trying to improve it. I don't quite agree with how they went about it, but they are trying something other than the Schwartz method of consistent failure!

    If you don't like the Raiders Walters, not my problem. I think the Raiders have turned themselves into the biggest joke of a team since they got beat in the SB.

    Are you implying that all of Collins INT's are on well thrown balls and that this is somehow the QB's fault??? This is as wrong a concept as there is. Most of Collins INT's are from overthrowing WR's on deep routes or slant/posts, getting hit while throwing, or making a bad decision. How do you balme a QB for a well thrown ball that a WR doesn't catch?

    I don't suppose you take the credit AWAY from Volek when his WR catches an 8 yd out and then takes it down the sideline for a TD? Be consistent. If the WR makes the QB look good, give credit to the WR. Sure Volek got him the ball as he should, but the WR made the TD. If the WR makes the QB look bad, the WR should get the blame. Similarly, if the QB makes a bad throw and the WR makes a spectacular catch, I'm not gonna talk about how wonderful the QB is, but I will talk about how well the WR bailed out the QB. Give credit where credit is due.

    My final argument was NOT that Collins knows an equal # of plays or less than Volek. My argument was that the coaching staff feels even with his limited knowledge of the offense, they think KC gives us a better chance to win than Volek. I don't necessarily agree with them, but that is the ONLY logical conclusion one can draw from Collins starting week 1.

    The other logical conclusion we can draw is that Volek did something to get himself canned. He went from starting QB to a quick trip off the team faster than any player not physically injured.

    Gut

    PS - Don't worry, the VY era will start soon!
  4. Blazing Arrow The 12th man

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    So you are saying that the Raiders knowing they already have there QB of the future decided to dump Collins for the more limber and better suited A Brooks. When you actually write that out and read that that is what you are getting at? That is silly. Brooks is terrible everyone in the league knows that and the Raiders pass on Collins, the writing on the wall was obvious that he is washed up. I think the Raiders organization, fans, and coaches made the choice not to go with Collins. Why bring in a new horse when your old one knows the course? I guess the same question should be asked of the Titans? Every football analysts that bothers to bring us up seems to ask the same question. We are the laughing stock of the NFL and we are being lead by a clown.

    OK let’s kill this myth right now since people seem to use it as some proof of Collins ability. Though Collins was the starting QB for the Panthers in ’96 he in no way led them to the playoffs. I would think the defense with the second lowest points allowed all season was the work horse in that deal. That is like saying Banks or Dilfer took the 2000 Ravens to the Super Bowl, which by the way was another team that completely owned Collins.

    Yeah I would say a guy who performs at 25/39 64% 320 yards 1 TD 0 INTs being told he is not “making the right reads” is what is called a scapegoat. It may have only been preseason but it seems allot better then what we have or will see from Collins. Fulfilling his dream? He has been in the league for several years he had a no trade clause and had opportunities in the past to go to other teams but passed. When did he realize that being an NFL starter was his “dream”? It would seem more likely if this was dream fulfillment that he would have moved on earlier but he did not he stayed the course and got burned out right for it.

    Then how do you explain Collins starting next week after his last 2 performance (3 if you count the preseason game)?

    Again I point to Volek’s stats and the term “stinks up the joint” does not come to mind. Neither does Joe Montana but you get my point here. He was not playing that bad for us. Running game maybe?

    I am not implying in anyway that Collins INTs are all well thrown balls. From what I have seen I would say less then 50% of his passes are well thrown balls. Most of his INTs come of out routes that he over throws and they end up going to the house. Something we have been fortunate not to see yet but the season is still young. Blame Troupe for being hit in the hands but do not blame Bennett for not catching that ball. He would never have made a catch on that ball. I can only thing of maybe 2 WR in the league who probably would have. Now he could have made a play of the ball I do not think that is unlikely to break it up. I am not making excuses for Bennett I think he drops allot of balls. The one that went threw his hands two seasons ago in the endzone stands out the biggest to me, but that is not the point of this. It was a poorly thrown ball and his Collins WR did not stretch out for him to save his arse. Blame that on timing or what ever but do not deny they pass was terrible to start with. WR make plays QBs make plays but only when they work together does every thing work out. How many times has Manning been bailed out by great play from Harrison? It does not mean that either player is a bad player they know each other.

    What was the logic for week 2 or even week 3 when we still could have had Volek? No I think the coaches knew exactly who would have been the better QB and passed on it. If your passer rating is worst then if you just spiked the ball it does not take a veteran scout to figure out you are not getting the job done and probably never will for this team. It is not like he is a rookie learning the speed of the game, he is a vet QB making bad reads, under throwing our WRs, and giving the ball up. He is not able to get us past the marker so we might as well run on every play because at least we are getting positive yards instead of incomplete passes.

    That I can agree with. This discussion would have been allot better if we still had Volek but we do not. I have been quite lately so might as well vent some of my Collins haterade now and get it out of my system ……. ok

    Someone call PETA because this Sunday our nets are not Dolphin free. Let’s get a win on these fish boys.
  5. Toly Free your mind

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    Gut - I have a really hard time imagining a scenario where Volek was missing so many reads in such a short amount of time that a change was so desperately and immediately needed. But if you could provide me a link to where Fisher says this, that would be great.

    Volek has been with the Titans for many years and I don't remember anyone mentioning anything about Volek reading issues. Not our former OC and not Chow last year, even though Volek played all of the preseason games and a few regular games. If Volek really had a big problem with reads, the coaching staff would have noticed this a while ago, and they certainly wouldn't have given the starting spot to Volek after McNair's departure - they would have brought someone else right away.

    Suddenly, after a few quarters of play in preseason, Volek is missing a gigantic amount of reads as if he was possessed by a soccer player that has never played football before. I mean, it is so bad that the coaching staff feels they have a better chance of winning by bringing in (and starting) a washed up QB less than two weeks before the season opener. I'm sorry but I'm not buying this.

    Like I posted in another thread... it's not about what you did, it's all about what you do now. He is not that QB anymore and his 7-27 record (or something like that) as the starter in his latest games is a good proof of that.
  6. Slackmaster Starter

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    When Chow came to Nashville, weren't we told that he was the kind of genius O.C. that adapted his schemes according to the talent that he had on the team. That he didn't need a "Chow" type of player.

    I suppose we can chalk this up to another lie told by the Titan's organization.
  7. Gut Starter

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    Guys...

    The fact that the Raiders dumped Collins is not proof of any sort that he is washed up. They brought Jeff George out of 5 years retirement. That should tell you who the REAL laughing stock of the NFL is.

    As for Collins...

    I never said he was the greatest QB in the world. But he has been a solid starter and he has had some good seasons. Volek on the other hand is 3-7 as a starter. When I say Collins led 2 teams to the NFC Champ game and 1 to the Super Bowl, I didn't mean he threw for 5000 yards and 50 TD's. But even great defenses need a QB to make throws at critical times. And frankly, Collins did tear up Minnesota in that game.

    I agree that Collins made a bad throw on that one pick. If I recall, our RT got burnt on the play and the pressure forced a bad throw. As you mentioned, Harrison and Wayne pick up Peyton a lot when he makes bad throws. Well, when your RT gets beat and the QB makes a bad throw...the WR needs to try and pick them both up by at least going for the ball. If Bennet went for it, I don't think Dyson would have caught it.

    I've heard over the past couple of years that Volek is great on throwing the deep ball, but has not been as effective in the short-intermediate area....maybe it was on NFL matchup or something along those lines. I think the Titans didn't mind that since he wasn't starting yet and I think they figured by the time Volek gets his chance to start, he'll have fixed that problem or they'll get someone else. Well, it looks like he's still not making those same 'easy' reads. So it's not like it was only based on 3 quarters of play...

    If you check through Titansonline, Fisher made a comment about Billy missing easy reads in one of the audio segments...probably around the time when Collins was signed.

    But the Titans signing Collins should not have been a shocker to Volek when the offense was inconsistent AND he was missing 'easy reads.' In short, I don't he was missing a zillion reads, but a few here and there can mean punting instead of continuing a drive or worse...missing a wide open WR down the field. I think TJ or someone made a comment about this that they saw a wide open WR down the field and Volek check down to a short guy.

    Now I wouldn't blame all of the offensive woes on Volek certainly. We certainly have OL issues which are affecting our pass and run game. But I think they worried that Volek may not make the change (reading defenses better) so they wanted to bring in another guy. Based on Fisher's comments yesterday, we know why Collins was rushed into start. Fisher took great umbrage to Volek demanding a trade....again. At that point, the staff voted unanimously to trade Volek and not play him since he didn't want to be here. This is according to Fisher's comments I saw on Sportscenter last night. And Fisher said Volek through the organization under the bus along with several teammates. Hmmmm.

    I agree that Collins SHOULD have been benched in the Chargers game since he looked completely lost. I would have inserted VY and gone 3 WRS, 1 TE, 1 RB and let VY pick the matchup he liked best or run. But clearly the coaching staff didn't want to rush him and didn't want Volek to play...which left in Collins. Let's hope Collins learns the offense sooner rather than later and each game we get a little more VY.

    This would be much alleviated if our D was kicking butt and taking names, but we have many issues on that side of the ball too!

    I hope Collins gets straightened out enough to be solid. If not, VY will be starting at Texas and we'll at least have his development to watch. I also hope our D gets fixed, but I'm much less hopeful with that since I think Schwartz is THE biggest problem with the D.

    Gut
  8. Vigsted Starter

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    At least the Raiders were sensible to cut George soon after because they realised he did indeed suck.

    Volek went 3-7 in his last 10 starts, Collins went 7-27 in his last 34.

    McNair was missing "easy reads" and checking down to TE's and RB's all last year, yet Volek isn't allowed to in his first season as a starter and second with this offence?
  9. PhiSlammaJamma Yao

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    I tried rolling off my sofa today in an attempt to land the Titans starting qb job.
  10. Gut Starter

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    Vig...


    How good of a Raider team was Collins playing on the last 2 years? He at least went to a Gaints team and helped solidify the QB position enough for them to go to the SuperBowl.

    No one is suggesting that Collins is the savior of Nashville. With as much info as we have, it appears Volek couldn't handle a little competition and wanted out. Collins and VY are what's left.

    It might not be pretty...but this is it 'til VY takes over fulltime. Personally, I'd work a heck of a lot of short yardage packages with VY and impliment them as often as possible in every game (when it's 3rd and short or we're within the 10 yard line (extreme red zone).

    We need to protect Collins and he needs to 'manage' the game.

    Of course, we also need the D to give up more like 20 ppg if we are to have a shot...not 31!

    And this just in from ESPN...they are recommending fantasy teams start Ronnie Brown cause the Titans D is avg'ing giving up 166yds per game on the ground!

    OUCH!

    Gut
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