Vince talks about why he went back

The QB ultimately bears the responsibility of offensive production. So- yes. Much the same way that a QB gets credit for an outstanding TD reception by a WR, TE or RB.

 

We could surround Vince with high school talent on offense and many on this board would blame Vince for the lack of production. This team probably has the some of the worst talent at the skill positions of any team in the league, with poor playcalling in the redzone and still made the playoffs. Surround Vince with talent-aka guys that can go up and make a catch on a fade, go route, or make people miss and he will put up numbers. I am not convinced that the skill position players we have are better than the guys he had at Texas--when surrounded by talent, he will thrive. I have faith that he will put in the time and do the work, now the front office needs to do their job.

 

Think about, who is the best target Vince has had in 2 seasons in the NFL?

Drew Bennett? Bobby Wade? Justin Gage? Roydell Williams? Bo Scaife?
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Sorry to knock these guys, cause I like and root for most of them. But this is going to be Vince's third year, and it would be nice just to see what could happen if we had a true playmaking WR.

 

Exactly, which one of those guys would start for just any other team? Our best receiver (Bennett) left for big money and hardly saw the field.

But let's blame it on how he spent his vacation. Maybe if the receivers practiced 20 hours a day they would be better. They are probably just not committed enough to the team...

 

Talent goes only so far in the breakdown of VY's regress. He did have 17 INT's- the vast majority of which were bad reads or throws. Don't misunderstand me- I have nothing against Vince. I WANT him to do well. But an honest look at his year reveals he DID struggle and DID NOT make progress in red zone scoring, passing TD's and INTs.

 

And I don't disagree that he didn't have a pro-bowl caliber season, but in my opinion it had very little to do with lack of preparation, and more to do with his quad injury, which made him change his game. He got used to that toward the end of the year and started throwing bette-averaging a higher QB rating over the last 6 weeks than a majority of the league. And it had to do with a lack of talent surrounding him. He had several picks on 50/50 balls that a guy like Randy Moss turns into TDs. Quality receivers turn average throws into big plays, whereas our guys turn them into picks.

Vince has work to do, but my argument is that he can do that while taking some down time. He can certainly do both, and the argument that he should spend all of his offseason on nothing but football is frankly assinine. I can't imagine that anybody on this board advocates working their employees (or themselves) 80 hours a week year round, so why should we expect Vince to do that.

His taking class has nothing to do with performance on the field. If he doesn't do his football work, you have a right to complain, but you don't have proof that that is happening.

 

Good post, well said throughout.


I don't blame it all on the WRs, but its a bigger problem than the time he spends going to class in Austin.

 

His performance has everything to do with preparation. That is absurd you would make such a suggestion. Sure the quad injury limited his running ability, but the NFL is full of QB's that don't run and post higher than a 71.1 QB rating. I also take strong exception that his 17 INT's were a result of his WR's and not poor reads or poorly thrown balls. I don't know what games you were watching, but I can think of 3 balls at the most that were picked as a result of poor WR or TE play. And Vince is FULLY aware of the talent of his receivers. It is his choice to throw into tight coverage to a sub-par WR or select the next read. You just can't blame the WR- that is ridiculous.

Vince's QB ratings were erratic. He finished the post-season with a 53.3 so he definitely did not trend upward. He had 2 games over 100 against Indy's scrubs and a sub-par KC defense. He posted a few 30's in there as well.

http://www.nfl.com/players/vinceyoung/gamelogs?id=YOU617196

Nobody is advocating Vince play/study football 80 hours/week all year. The point that has been made is that the time he spends pursuing his degree competes with time that could be dedicated to learning a new offense, working on throwing mechanics, and improving his ability to read defenses. The great NFL athletes universally comment that their OFF-SEASON efforts are what enabled them to separate themselves from the middle of the pack.

If Vince's performance last year was exemplary- or even just showed improvement this wouldn't be as much of an issue to some people.

It still boils down to the simple fact that if he doesn't guide the team to a better red zone efficiency, improve his passing TD's and decrease his INT's his off-season dedication issues will be under increased scrutiny.

Some folks act like Vince's poop doesn't stink. I'm just trying to keep it real.

 

Football is a team sport. His performance has a lot to do with the quality of his teammates. It is absurd to not understand that. When Steve Young struggled early in his year was it lack of preparation? I have a feeling it was because Tampa was terrible. And he thrived with the 49ers when surrounded by Pro Bowl caliber players. Culpepper was great with Moss. Does he just not prepare enough now? No, his talent is much worse. McNabb was great with Owens--maybe he plays too much golf now, because his numbers aren't nearly the same...

A big part of Vince's game is the ability to run--he had reinvent himself, which is difficult to do.

You are kidding right? Of course some of the Ints were his fault--I recognize that in my previous post. he has work to do, but you can't honestly think that his INT numbers wouldnt go down, and his TD numbers way up with NFL Quality receivers.

You misrepresented the stats and my post. If we can agree that 99.9 can round up to 100, he had 3 games of 100 rating or better in his last 5 regular season games and only 1 game in the 30s (few indicates more than 1, so I am not sure why you would make a misleading post and then give a link). And only 4 of his 17 INTs came in the last 5 games. All this while they went 4-1 to make the playoffs for the first time in several years. If that isn't trending upwards, I don't know what is. I am too lazy to look, but using the criterial layed out (Int, games over 100 rating and win loss) I doubt there are 3 QBs who played as well over the last 5 weeks.

That's just it though-you essentially are when you question how he spends 15 hours per week of his time. We can all agree that he should work 40 hours a week on football-what should I care what he does with the rest of his time-especially when it is something I can be proud to tell my child about? What would you prefer him to do during his non-football related time--hit the clubs with Pac Man? As long as he puts in his football time-40 hours per week or so, why should you care?

 

I'm actually going to answer my own question-not directed at you Riverman or anyone else, but I have holding this back for several weeks now, and can hold it in any longer.

I read a journal article that was cited in one of the conversations regarding race in the primaries that cited that whites are often resentful of African Americans who value education. I am not saying that it is true of everyone, but I wonder if that factor might be in play here, as he is doing his job and trying to improve himself at the same time. Yet the argument is that this particular player needs to spend all of his waking hours dedicated to football and nothing else. And then the argument that he doesn't need to spend all of his time with football, but don't go back to school because that is a distraction. It would be acceptable to work full time and play golf or go to the clubs, but don't you dare go to class. Plus he must be stupid--he talks different than us.

I'm not accusing anyone in particular, but I wonder if being a predominantly white, southern fanbase, if that doesn't come into play.