Should we draft a QB in the 1st round?

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by pettso, Mar 4, 2011.

?
  1. Yes.

    10 vote(s)
    27.0%
  2. No.

    23 vote(s)
    62.2%
  3. Undecided.

    4 vote(s)
    10.8%
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  1. pettso

    pettso Starter

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    I understand that all things have to be measured equally, but I don't see how the consistent failure of QBs drafted in the 2nd round is not a valid point on its own. Think of it as QBs that weren't evaluated by NFL scouts as the top of their class consistently fail.

    A large part of the reason they don't succeed is that there's only 1 starting QB per team, unlike many other positions where there's multiple and thats not even counting positions where players are rotated in and out based on down/formation/etc. Of the ~5 QBs drafted this year, chances of more than 1-2 having a successful career are really slim. Going further, chances of the 4th-5th rated one having a successful career are even slimmer.

    There's a gamble to be made on virtually every QB coming out of college. Ponder's is injuries, Mallett's is attitude, Newton's is football intelligence, Locker's is accuracy, etc.. Any one of those weaknesses could potentially be the difference between a successful QB and an unsuccessful one.

    I'd imagine NFL scouts are pretty good at their job and they factor risk/reward into the decisions they make. As an example, comparing Locker and Ponder they'd look at the chances of Locker's accuracy improving vs. chances of Ponder remaining healthy.

    Also, wasn't Locker projected to possibly go 1st overall last year?
     
  2. 24

    24 Starter

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    Their consistent failures can be attributed to other reasons (fewer opportunities), that's why.

    And, Locker was projected to go first overall by Todd McShay. Big difference.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/football/nfl/07/06/national.grades.draft/index.html
     
  3. pettso

    pettso Starter

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    The way I look at it is, regardless of what the reasons behind it are, a failure is a failure. The same exact reasons would apply to a QB that is drafted in the 2nd round now as a QB that was drafted in the 2nd round over the past 10 years.

    We are not comparing apples to oranges here. We're projecting the probability of success for a QB drafted in the 2nd round this year by using QBs drafted in the 2nd round historically. I'm not saying they've failed because they lack talent. I'm just saying that they've failed (which could be like you said a result of not having the same opportunities).

    The one point that you've got me thinking about is that often, QBs that are drafted in the 2nd round are drafted to be backups, whereas QBs drafted in the 1st round are picked up by teams that are in need for a starter right away. So looking over the list of 2nd round QBs that could potentially fall under that category I'd add these three to the list of potentially successful QBs that weren't given a fair shot due to an already established QB on the team:

    2006 Tarvaris Jackson Vikings
    2007 Kevin Kolb Philadelphia
    2008 Brian Brohm Green Bay

    That would up the ratio to 33% (4/12) which is significantly better than the previous 8% but still significantly worse than the 52% of 1st round picks. That may have been the argument you were trying to make and I misunderstood you.

    Again, I'm not saying Ponder is bad. I don't know him well enough to judge. I'm just looking into what's happened historically for general probabilities. There are always exceptions and great players are found late in the draft, I'd rather not take a bigger risk than we have to with the QB position which we've pretty much agreed is the cornerstone of any NFL team.

    Edit: To clarify, the other 8 QBs drafted in the 2nd round have had ample opportunities to succeed due to being on teams that have had serious QB troubles.
     
  4. 24

    24 Starter

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    Yep, that's all I was trying to say. The 33% is more in line with what I would expect. Lower success rate than the first rounders, but not as extreme as the original stat was portrayed.
     
  5. 24

    24 Starter

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    Does anyone think, maybe now that the lockout is somewhat inevitable, that we should avoid QB in the first? That first year is incredibly important for the QB, more so than any other position. Even if the season happens, chances are most of the workouts will be cancelled. I say avoid QB in the first, draft the BPA, then worry about QB in next year's draft. Maybe sign some stopgap, like Hasselbeck, to fill in.
     
  6. jessestylex

    jessestylex DeadGirlsCantSayNo

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    no, if our scouts think there is a great QB there at # 8 we need to take the chance. We need a guy who can come in mid season and show results. No team wants to start their rookie right away, but many of them hope he can come in mid season if needed to and step up.

    And chances are we will need help by mid season.
     
  7. 24

    24 Starter

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    Ok, but none of these QBs are prepared to step in right away, with the exception of Mallett, Ponder, and Dalton. No one is going to step in right away (especially without camps), the only advantage I see is that it will give us an excuse to "red shirt" the QB for one season. Starting someone prematurely, especially at QB, can be detrimental to their future progress.
     
  8. jessestylex

    jessestylex DeadGirlsCantSayNo

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    not really the last couple years Rookie Qb's have done good at having to take over. Didnt Flacco,Ryan,Mark,Brafford etc...have to step up right away?

    even VY came in his rookie season and played great, but he couldnt handle the pressure of the NFL the following season.
     
  9. 24

    24 Starter

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    Right, but my point is that all those QBs had offseason programs to learn the system. With this lockout, it looks like QBs won't get that opportunity. The only recent example of someone starting midseason without attending any of the offseason workouts is JaMarcus Russell, and we all saw how that turned out.
     
  10. jessestylex

    jessestylex DeadGirlsCantSayNo

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    but nobody knows how long the lock out will last, it's best to stick with your regular plans and hope for the best. what if we pass on a QB and the lockout if lifted before May? it's best not to gamble on what might happen here... go about it as normal.
     
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