Alex Brown on trade block..any takers?

We could use alex brown on our team we are dire need of a proven pass rusher.

 

Why trade one our starters on defense when we can trade away a future draft pick instead? That makes no sense.

We don't need to free up money anyway and Thornton isn't that expensive. Plus, we still have to eat the CAP hit on any prorated signing bonus we gave Thornton if we did trade him.

 

I think with another year or 2 Nande will step up and be our OLB. He just needs to learn the playbook and then he can let his atheltic ability take over. The guy is fast, explosive, strong ,and tenacious just a bit of a slow learner when it comes to playbooks.

 

cool

 

Rebutal...

I agree. While LaBoy needs to be upgraded...Brown is a small notch above into the mediocre category. He does play the run better and may be a slightly better pass rusher. But for that small upgrade, you want to give up a 2nd rnd pick AND use of a lot of our cap space for an average player?

If they had 3 DE's and in passing situations they took Brown off the field more than the other 2, what does that tell you about what the Bears think of him as a pass rusher? And Ogunleye only had 6.5 sacks. Clearly the Bears think Brown is the worst of the 3 as a pass rusher. So why should we overspend for him if he's not that good?

Actually, those ARE NOT the odds. Both Brown and Jared Allen were FOURTH rnd picks so it's not like you take a first rndr or you have no chance. And if we're merely trying to find a decent RDE (like Brown), they can be found in rnds 3 and 4 without it being a pipe dream. Of course, there are always some busts no matter where you choose and for whatever reasons (we can debate that another time), LaBoy and Odom have not developed (I would not have taken Schobel in rnd 4). The point of a 2nd rndr is to find a good DE, not an avg one. So I wouldn't give up a 2nd rnd pick for any DE less than a good pass rusher. And while a 3rd rnd pick sounds more reasonable, the contract cost will not be...making even that route too little bang for our buck.

I'm sure there are many points at which you don't believe that.

Well...Brown was given the ideal situations for a pass rusher...teams could NOT double him because of Tank Johnson, Tommy Harris, and Ogunleye. He's never had double digit sacks. The Chiefs on the other hand have had little threat in the way of a dominant DT or DE to draw off double teams. Much like KVB broke out his first year here and then had a drop in his sacks...we see the same with Allen. Hali was good this year...but he only got 8 sacks single blocked most of the time while Allen was doubled. Bring Allen over here and you'll see his stats jump closer to the previous year's 11 sacks. OR we'll see KVB get singled blocked and watch his numbers go back closer to his 12 sack Pro Bowl season. Either way, we get a real pass rush back adding Allen to the mix. Adding Brown will net us 7 sacks...3.5 more than we got from LaBoy last year and make no improvement to KVB's rush as teams usually block Brown with just the left tackle adequately.

So adding Allen, IMO, would do wonders for our team (if MR can structure the contract to protect us at least somewhat for Allen's character issues)...giving us a viable pass rush with just a 4 man rush. That means teams will have to use more blockers so we'll have more guys for coverage. This would really help our D!

Adding Brown would cost us a lot (even if it's 'only' a 3rd and a large contract) for not a whole lot in return. And because of that, I'd rather explore trading for a better player or spend a couple of picks on good DE prospects in next years draft. However, if the Titans aren't too keen on bringing Pacman back, they should see if he could be the focus of a Pacman for Allen deal. Both players get a fresh start and we get a much needed DE. Allen will also play more games than Pacman will this year too!

Gut

 

A little clarity...

Why would we trade a good OLB for an avg RDE? That would make the defense worse.

Secondly, while Reynolds has learned outside and Woods is listed outside on the depth chart, they are less proven at OLB than LaBoy is at RDE. So you'd turn those 2 spots from one good player and one below avg player into one avg player and one backup player. And in addition, we'd get to sign Brown to an expensive contract and take a $2.2mil cap hit this year for trading Thornton (the rest of his prorated signing bonus would hit us all at once).

I appreciate that you're trying to find a solution...any solution...but we have to weigh the cost with the benefit. If we could trade, say, Thornton, a 2nd and Laboy for Dwight Freeney, then it might be worth the cost for that good of a player (and then hope for a vet cut).

Gut

 

no way the colts give away freeney!!!!

 

they may not have a choice if they can't sign him to a contract. He is a free agent next year without a contract.

 

Gut,
You miss the whole point. Sure you can, might, could find a great pass rusher in any round of the draft. The odds are simply this, a proven vet in the hand is worth many draft picks in the bush so to speak. You give up a 2nd rounder for Brown you get a proven vet, a guy who comes in ready to contribute day one.
We drafted 3 DEs in one year, 2 in the 2nd round and 1 in the 4th and still don't have a player as good as Brown. You think giving up LaBoy's draft spot for a comparable player like Brown might have been a decent idea? What is the difference now? None.
Plus, you don't have to use multiple picks to get one good guy you just trade one pick, the guy plays right away (not having to be developed at all), instant upgrade (you avoid getting a bust) and depth. It is a no brainer.
Also Brown isn't going to be one of those CAP busting type guys like Freeney or Allen might be. Sure he will cost a little but it isn't like he is a franchise quality DE you have to pay in the top 5 or soemthing.

Oh, Brown probably was the #3 best pass rusher on the Bears. The guys in front of him are pretty good. It isn't exactly like saying he was the #3 pass rusher on the Titans. Also, we can still bring in DEs like Jacob Ford and if down the road one of these guys turns into a phenom of a pass rusher we just do what the Bears are doing, we trade off one of the guys we no longer need.

 

Sox...

I got your point but we disagree on two things. How much he'd improve us and whether or not that's worth the cost. We might also disagree on the value of getting a more dominant player...

When you say he'll come in and contribute right away...it doesn't mean as much to me as it does to you. He'll come in and not pull any double teams off KVB and leave us with a mediocre pass rush because Brown is mediocre. As I said, he'll get us another couple of sacks...say 3-4...and a bit better run support...but is that worth a chunk of cap spcae AND a 2nd rnd pick?

I don't want to pay a mediocre pass rusher a large contract (the avg price of DE's just went up so Brown will be expecting some serious cash). In addition, I don't give up 2nd rnd picks for mediocre players. In the second rnd, you're not looking for avg starting caliber players...you're looking for STAR players.

The good thing about getting a vet is you know what you're getting. In Brown's case, it's also the bad thing. We know what we're getting. We'd be better off trying to develop LaBoy and Odom than spending a 2nd rnd pick and a chunk of cap space for Brown. It's not smart if you wanna build a top 10 D. If you're looking at this as Brown (and the other improvements) could improve us to a mediocre D, yes, that's an improvement. But that improvement isn't gonna win us a Super Bowl.

Spend a 2nd+ for a more dominant player (like Allen) and you get an exponential increase in the D!

THAT, my friend, is the no brainer.

Gut