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31st in the league in sacks..scheme vs. personnel

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by Titans2004, Jan 3, 2012.

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  1. JCBRAVE @JCBRAVE

    Casey
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    Alright, let me clarify myself then, cause I do see how that's being misinterpreted. It was a broad statement.

    IMO and on tape, Babin's alignment and choice of moves makes it very difficult on the players around him. The other guys have a hard time knowing he'll be accountable. Therefore they may not have the intensity needed to win in the NFL.

    Pretend your a OLB. Just imagine what you're thinking when a right tackle thats not suppose to get to your level is there all the time. You can't do your job at that point.
  2. HeadOnASwivel Starter

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    In our case it's the perfect storm combination of both.

    A: We don't have good enough pass rushers on the edges to make a 4-3 scheme effective.

    B: We don't have the personnel to run a full time 3-4.

    I've been saying over and over that we need to make the switch to the 3-4 heres why...

    Finding DE's that are big enough to stop the run on 1st and 2nd down while, also, being able to get around the edges and consistently beat one on one blocking are not easy to come by. Guys like Julius Peppers, Mario Williams, Jared Allen and a few others don't just grow on trees.

    If you miss on DE's, which we have, then your 4-3 blows. If you can't get pressure from your DE's then you have to commit others to blitz leaving one on one situations in the secondary... which often gets us burned. (cough, cough... Griffin and Hope).

    The very natue of the 4-3 means you are playing more of a base defense, hoping that your front four can get pressure so you are not playing man in the back end. Sure you can mix coverages and do a good bit of stuting with your line but, at the end of the day, it's still does not provide the amount of coufusion that can be generated by a 3-4.

    This is why the 3-4 is a far superior defense. I'll try to explain...

    I noted earlier that 4-3 DE's are hard to find and I really believe they are. I'd say you get a couple studs per draft but that's about it... and the Titans have shown lately that they cannot get their hands on one.

    However, athletic, fast, "tweener" types of players are a friggin' dime a dozen in the draft. Finding an undersized guy that is too small to play a 4-3 end but a bit too big and immobile to play OLB is easy. Ask the Steelers how easy it is to find these guys in mid rounds and teach them to get up field after the QB.

    The other really nice thing about the 3-4 is all of the different blitz looks you can give the opposing offensive line and the matchups you can try to exploit by shifting your LB's all over the field.

    Make the offensive line have to dianose the blitz perfectly, because if they make a mistake the QB ends up on his booty most of the time.

    The thing is the Titans are kind of a 50/50 mix of 4-3 and 3-4 personnel in my eyes.

    Jason Jones = 3-4 end
    Derrick Morgan = 4-3 end
    Karl Klug = 3-4 end
    Dave Ball = 4-3 end
    William Hayes = 4-3 end

    Jurrell Casey = 4-3 DT
    Shaun Smith = 3-4 NT
    Sen'Derrick Marks = 4-3 DT

    Akeem Ayers = 3-4 OLB
    Colin McCarthy = 4-3 MLB
    Will Witherspoon = 4-3 OLB

    I think Gray wants to be able to run both looks so this draft will be intresting. If I were in charge I'd make the switch to the 3-4 now. Look at what Houston did after just one season. From 32nd to what 3rd, the proof is in the pudding.
  3. JCBRAVE @JCBRAVE

    Casey
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    But Jason Jones can't hold up 2 blockers to allow the OLB in. I mean he can, but not all game. He's not a 3-4 DE IMO.
  4. steverife Starter

    Wright
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    That is a fair statement. I wouldn't pin it solely on Babin because you know what you get with him, but scheme + Babin's weaknesses = vulnerability.

    I like Jones and Morgan. I think they are well rounded players. I also agree that it would be nice to have a pass rushing specialist and some more playmakers in general on defense.
    • Staff / Moderator

    TitanJeff Kahuna Grande

    Locker
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    I have to admit I'd love the Titans to go to 3-4 for the very reasons posted by Head. I think it is a more flexible defense which is more exciting to watch, IMO.

    Gray originally talked about Morgan being the guy who could stand up if the defense wanted to show a 3-4 look. Maybe with another draft and FA period, the Titans can find the personnel to work in some 3-4 during the OTAs.
  5. cdubbs2121 Starter

    C. Johnson
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    personally I just want us to get meaner on defense. I miss the days. of Albert Haynesworth being a terror up front, while not always good he was a wrecking machine in the middle.

    Now we have too many Will Witherspoons, and no name D lineman. We need to get a mean streak in our D like Jerome Harrison or the Ravens got going every year
  6. Vigsted Starter

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    This is an incredibly blue-eyed statement. Playing OLB is NOT just a question of having the right physical specification (and btw players having the power to take on an OT/TE and the speed to cover a WR are NOT a dime a dozen). It requires a much higher degree of football awareness because you often have primary responsibility against the run and pass at the same time.

    I play for a team that employs a simplified version of the Steelers 3-4 and I can tell you the OLB is the overall most challenging position on the field (with the NT being the most physically challenging).

    And if the 3-4 was such a superior defence and players a dime a dozen, why does only a few teams run it?
  7. Scarecrow CEO of PPO

    Wright
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    I would like to switch to a 3-4, but not if it means getting rid of our current 4-3 players.

    You are basically talking about completely new personal, and we have promise on both levels we would be replacing.

    Why take the chance of switching to a new scheme, when we only have one piece we really need for our 4-3? Then have to find all new pieces for a 3-4 and HOPE that some of these "hybrid" players pan out.

    Too much to risk right now, if we were going to switch, it should have been during the salary cap explosion. Not when we were already half way rebuilt and trying to be competitive. Maybe another day, but not anytime soon IMO.
  8. Scarecrow CEO of PPO

    Wright
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    I do know this, with the emergence of Houston, the possibility of Peyton, or Luck being as proclaimed, we need a MUCH better pass rush to be competitive next year.

    The Jags can just be the Jags, no one is counting on them to be mentioned anytime soon.
  9. RollTide All-Pro

    Bishop
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    I think Jones and Klug are better in the 4-3 than they would be in a 3-4.

    Moving from the 3-4 to the 4-3 DT is no excuse for Smith. His role was not that different and he was not the stout run stopper we signed him to be.

    Put Wilfork at DT in this defense and he would be great there.


    Everybody picks on Palmer but Grey's defense this year was a major fail in 2 areas. Getting to the QB and stopping the run.
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