“More probable than not” Patriots manipulated balls.

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by VondyP, May 6, 2015.

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  1. Alzarius

    Alzarius Pro Bowler Tip Jar Donor

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    You answered a question with a question. Are you OK with them doing it, even if its against the rules?
     
  2. Big TT

    Big TT AKA QUADZILLA-STATE CHAMP-

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    Even playing field if they all do (and they were, well documented)...same I suspect for the QB and their "balls"...still hard to type that.
     
  3. Riverman

    Riverman That may be.... Tip Jar Donor

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    ".............The report stated that investigators “offered to allow Brady’s counsel to screen and control the production so that it would be limited strictly to responsive materials and would not involve (their) taking possession of Brady’s telephone or other electronic devices.”

    ........

    “Brady’s refusal to provide us with his own emails, text messages and phone records on relevant topics, in response to our narrowly tailored requests, limited the evidence available for our review and analysis,” the report said. “We believe that our findings are nevertheless supported by the evidence and information available to us during the course of our work.”

    Read more at: Tom Brady Wouldn’t Give DeflateGate-Related Emails, Texts To Investigators | New England Patriots | NESN.com

    Tom Brady refused to show his phone for NFL deflated balls investigation - Business Insider

    The Wells report also criticized Brady for this, saying he wouldn't turn over the cellphone even though his lawyers could "screen and control" which texts they saw:

    "Similarly, although Tom Brady appeared for a requested interview and answered questions voluntarily, he declined to make available any documents or electronic information (including text messages and emails) that we requested, even though those requests were limited to the subject matter of our investigation (such as messages concerning the preparation of game balls, air pressure of balls, inflation of balls or deflation of balls) and we offered to allow Brady's counsel to screen and control the production so that it would be limited strictly to responsive materials and would not involve our taking possession of Brady's telephone or other electronic devices. Our inability to review contemporaneous communications and other documents in Brady‟s possession and control related to the matters under review potentially limited the discovery of relevant evidence and was not helpful to the investigation."

    On Tuesday, lead investigator Tedd Wells gave some more details about this on a conference call. He said that they didn't even request Brady's phone, they just needed printouts of certain communications:



    Read more: Tom Brady refused to show his phone for NFL deflated balls investigation - Business Insider
     
    #343 Riverman, May 14, 2015
    Last edited: May 14, 2015
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  4. Ten_Titans

    Ten_Titans Pro Bowler

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    What proof do you have to offer that players are on steroids?

    The players are big, but they aren't huge. You can get to be that big off supplements that aren't steroids. Especially if you are an elite athlete.

    [​IMG]

    That's steroids. NFL players don't look like that.

    "Not natural, obviously not natural blah blah"

    This isn't 1945. You can be not "natural" and still not be taking illegal steroids.
     
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  5. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    He got a pittance of a suspension. The NFL wants people to comply with the rules. Farmer got 4 games for simply breaking the rules, not on the field and gaining no competitive advantage and with full cooperation and accepting all blame.

    Brady broke the rules ON THE FIELD with a deliberate act to circumvent the officials in a playoff game no less, then lied about it and didn't fully cooperate. If his name was Teddy Bridegwater, he'd be gone for the year for sure. But the NFL doesn't want Brady out for the season or even half the season. It would damage their 'product!'
     
    • Hit the Target Hit the Target x 1
  6. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    This is silly. You can't put pressure on someone over the phone.

    And why is Wells saying the Pats would not make McNally available for a 2nd interview? How would McNally refuse the interview or if he did, why isn't it reported that way?

    The only logical conclusion? How is this difficult? Brady and the Pats know nothing about this and Brady lied saying he didn't know anything about this stuff. Pretty damning after telling the Ravens to go look up the rule book. But then we have nearly all of their balls underinflated beyond league rules and the Patriots supposed own investigation turned up nothing. Funny thing is, they also didn't get into any detail about how Brady likes his balls PSI-wise. Kraft and others claim this is a witch hunt and after nothing is found, Kraft wants an apology. Kraft welcomed Wells as the investigator and the Pats and Brady said they would cooperate...

    UNTIL...they found something. Brady has since been parsing his words and letting his agent cry like a baby about nonsense (it was a sting!). Meanwhile the Pats have been less than forthright and basically admitted something was wrong when they suggested they would accept whatever punishment the league handed down figuring they cutoff the evidence and what they had wasn't enough to do real damage to them. Somewhat wrong.

    So now that the league slapped Brady with a bigger suspension than they thought (according to reporters), docked them some picks and levied them a 1mil fine....now Wells was not an independent investigator, Kraft is mad, Brady will appeal, and they will continue to lie (we cooperated fully...nope) and claim the league is out to get them.

    It is interesting you seem to think Wells had it out for Brady and was trying to get to his personal info even though he and the report have said the opposite so much so as to be almost ridiculous the level of trust they were going to give him and his lawyer. However, I can see why this would be a real problem for two possible/probable conditions. First, they may find out the length of time this has been going on and it has been happening for more than a year, Brady and Belicheck would have to be suspended for the season. Other possiblity of following keyword searches is it may lead them to others who had knowledge of this. Others who had no direct contact with either equipment guy. I think this is the reason they asked for that info because Brady either has to not give them anything or leave out damaging texts and lie about giving them everything. Of course, if they did find out one of these other people with knowledge of it or some email/text from further back that Brady didn't turn over, he'd get slapped much harder.

    Otherwise, if Brady is truly innocent, why wouldn't you give them all text/emails relating to this if there was nothing to hide? He wouldn't get a suspension if he was innocent and the maybe the Pats fully cooperate and only get hit with a small fine, maybe docked a late round pick for show, but Brady has nothing happen to him. Why wouldn't they follow this path if Brady was innocent?
     
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  7. Vigsted

    Vigsted Starter

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    I don't think Well had it out for Brady or the Patriots personally. I just think the foregone conclusion was they cheated and the efforts were aimed at proving it, rather than conduct a fair and open investigation.

    As to what Brady could hand over to Wells, I can again only say that if what you and Riverman are saying is true, I can't figure out who is dumber. Ted Wells for being willing to accept anything Brady provides if he "promises" it's everything or Tom Brady for not taking advantage of it and providing only non-incriminating data and subsequently delete any potential incriminating data.
     
  8. Riverman

    Riverman That may be.... Tip Jar Donor

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    Get your head out of the sand. It's in the report and it's been published. It's not just Gut and me saying it.

    Gut summarizes the reason(s) DeflateGate went down like it did best. Read his posts a few times. If you believe in fair play, then you should feel the league got this one more right than others.
     
  9. Big TT

    Big TT AKA QUADZILLA-STATE CHAMP-

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    You can prove none of your opinions.
     
  10. Ten_Titans

    Ten_Titans Pro Bowler

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    So I take it you have a more complex rebuttal than bs'ing my post in the works?
     
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