is it fair to compare whiz to munch??

Discussion in 'Tennessee Titans and NFL Talk' started by 520, Oct 26, 2014.

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  1. GoT

    GoT Strength and Honor

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    totally the little guys 'fault' that he is clearly not the best or second best run option


    :cj: sucks and has since he got payed

    your focus on ypc is odd. yes its important, but not as important as getting a yard on third and 1 or getting 3-4 yards on 1st and 2nd downs
     
    #91 GoT, Oct 30, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2014
  2. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    ROFL!!! Your evidence is to ask a question? Again, try looking at the last time you said it then gave the evidence yourself to refute your claim.

    So name me the best 10 coaches in NFL history and tell me how they are just as good as the worst 10 coaches. So there should be just as many scrub coaches who have multiple SB rings as the top coaches right?
     
  3. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    That's odd, you compare CJ...who is now a backup RB to Sankey, our starter on a rb by comittee and say not many rb's could get 1000yds behind this OL. So are you saying Sankey is an elite RB because at 4 ypc he only needs 250 carries (which is low for a starting rb) to make 1000 yards...not exactly hard if you get the carries.

    I find it interesting you use ypc and then 1000 yards as bench marks out of context. First, CJ and Sankey both have 4.0 ypc averages but there are 2 very big differences. Sankey is our best back and hasn't gotten a lot of help. No back on our roster with similar carries has as good a YPC as Sankey.

    So what you fail to see is that CJ is NOT the feature back of the Jets. Chris Ivory is! And Ivory's YPC is 4.7...considerably higher than CJ's 4.0. And Ivory has more carries and doesn't get many carries on a 3rd and 20 like CJ does. Unlike most other posters, I live in NY and watch the Jets games by default. So CJ's avg is lower than the starting rb for his team which should tell you a lot. Sankey's is the highest on the team with that # of carries.

    What you also fail to see is another stat people overlook. 1st down %. A lot of posters have explained that CJ dances too much which leads to a ton of negative yardage plays which makes your offense very inconsistent. Chris Ivory's 1st down % is 25.7% so a quarter of his runs he gets a first down. Sankey's is 21.3% so about 1 in 5 runs. Cj...behind that same line that's allowing Ivory to get a first down every fourth run...CJ's average is a paltry 9.0%!!! A first down LESS than 1 in 10 runs!

    So let's review, you defend CJ's ypc in his last season by pointing to the year before (which doesn't help) and then say our OL is terrible and very few rb's could get 1000 yards behind our line. Well, last I checked, 4.0 ypc x 250 carries would equal 1000yds so IF Sankey wasn't in a rb by committee and we werent down so much in most games to give him fewer carries, he would easily hit 1000yds and probably more likely 1200+yds. CJ made 1000yds with a meager 3.5ypc so your claim is ridiculous only in that few coaches would give a rb 250+ carries who couldn't do better than a 3.5ypc avg.

    So if you think few rb's could reach 1000yds behind our line, are you saying Sankey is an elite RB...because 250 carries isn't that many carries for a feature rb. A rb who gets 20 carries a game would have 320+ carries in a season, right?

    CJ is a big name who is good for the occasional highlight reel run (though Ivory has more than CJ does). CJ was brought in to make people think they are trying this year (management) when the Jets simply aren't. Idzik wants Rex gone (he inherited Rex) and has underspent their cap by $24mil this year (prior to the Harvin trade). Rex didn't get any of the players he wanted and now that it's too late, they sign Harvin. I'll be interested to see if CJ does to the Jets what he did to us...play lax until the last game or so and then go all out to try and convince people he can still play. He will certainly be cut and not be a Jet in 2015 as he would have a cap hit of $5.5mil (3mil sb prorated to 1.5 and a 4mil sal and bonus).

    CJ was special his first 2 years, but he isn't anymore and hasn't been since he hit 2k. Not only did his ypc drop, but his % of 1st down runs has stayed below 20% every year since he hit 2k. Also, his # of 20+yd runs has declined every single year since then too. Sorry, but Sankey is a better rb right now and is a shifty/high effort player (like CJ used to be his first 2 years in the league).
     
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  4. kenny

    kenny Starter

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    You mean his yards per attempt are on par. He is averaging 3.9yds this yr. 268yds total on 67 attempts with 1 TD.

    Sankey has 302yds on 75 attempts with 1 TD 4.0yds per carry.

    You claim CJ is the greatest thing we have ever had in TN. He is being replaced by a 2nd round rookie.

    I am not saying he wasn't good at one point. I am saying he is not there anymore. You should recognize that by the fact that Sankey, a rookie still learning to play has replaced his production.
     
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  5. 520

    520 2020 GOAT CHAMP from 3-7 to champ

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  6. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    There is a difference between not caring how he gets from one place to another and an option route (usually 2-4 options depending on the coverage and positioning). Arguably, option routes are better in that you can adapt the route to the defense to give you the best 'option.' The flip side of this is the WR and QB have to be in sync and read things the same way. Wasn't KW one of the best 3rd down WR's last year?

    This is not evidence of poor coaching, it is good coaching. Plenty of other things to point out as bad coaching...like no player accountability for instance. But don't bash something they actually did well.

    And just because Whiz doesn't give our current players option routes doesn't mean it's a bad thing either, just a different style. But it does put more pressure on the QB to make the right read AND deliver the ball at the right time.
     
  7. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    Huh? If I read your post correctly, you're blaming Whiz for Locker (whom he didn't draft), Shonn Green or McCluster (Whiz definitely has to do with McCluster but not Greene), and most of the OL was here before Whiz except for Oher and Lewan.

    A lot of our success will depend on having/getting at least a solid starting QB. If we can fix the QB spot and perhaps OL, we have a nice nucleus on offense to build around and our D is about 3 players away from having real potential.

    Schiano didn't do a lot with TB except set them back a few years. Why do we want him?
     
  8. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    I agree. On the surface, Casey hasn't been as big as I was hoping. However, the defense has played so many extra snaps they have probably played extra games worth. Even with rotating guys, our D has been getting worn out big time. Several games they have looked much better early on only to get worn out later. The Texans game was a good example of that. Browns game too.

    Only so many times you can keep putting your D right back on the field. We don't have a top 5 talent D that can get us right back off the field on 3rd down.

    I havent specifically been focusing on Casey but Im gonna start re-watching some games and watch more closely our OL and DL to see.
     
  9. Gut

    Gut Pro Bowler

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    He hasn't? I guess a 30+yd TD run is not a big run?
     
  10. Childress79

    Childress79 Loungefly ®

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    He's also the only guy on our line that opposing teams have to account for on every down so he's permanently double teamed. Given that he's having a great season again.
     
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